Just to much....CRAFTING!

[Glennfinnan]

I recall one of the devs talking about eventually adding wood tiers so it'd probably reflect your ideas a bit [the furniture and housing wood kind dependant ones].

I shouldn't post this (don't want to give them ideas), but I hope they aren't thinking of something like this for metals.

Well, it was long before the "Boarded Up Feelings" development so I don't even know if these plans haven't shifted. :p

[rkaney]

Vanguard stands out to me because of the minigame aspect to crafting items. Events would pop up and would have to be countered. Success depended on your skill and affected the end result quality.

Never played Vanguard because I was neck-deep running auctions on the Exchange in EQ2. If the crafting min-game wasn't any more involved than that one, it's still a junk system. (From what I've heard from others, it wasn't any harder.) The only two "involved" crafting mini-games I've ran into so far are Puzzle Pirates (everything is a mini-game puzzle) and Free Realms.

I left EQ2 before they reworked the crafting. Ive heard people talk about it and it seemed similar in the idea anyway. Vanguard had a million other things wrong with it including devs cocaine habits but thats beside the point. Salem is being advertised as a crafting mmo, and it still has a long way to go in this aspect.

[Niding2]

I never played HnH. I have always enjoyed crafting in mmo's. The two that stand out in my mind were SWG and vanguard. SWG success i think was attributed to the large range of resources available, each resource had different 7 or 8 atrributes on a range of 0 - 1000 based. Resources were mined and the nodes were reset/respawned every week or 2. The combinations were basically endless and you were always hunting for better resources through trade or mining yourself.

Vanguard stands out to me because of the minigame aspect to crafting items. Events would pop up and would have to be countered. Success depended on your skill and affected the end result quality.

Both games are vastly different and the systems wouldnt transfer to salem easily, but the concepts would. Variety and quality matters and provides a richness and depth with resources. Resources are finite and not unlimited. Introduce skill and effort which can impact the quality of items crafted.

Oh god yes, the crafting minigame in Vanguard. So love that.

Vanguard's F2P now by the way, good time to rediscover it.

[rkaney]

Regarding crafting, i've got some ideas regarding trees and wood that could be used to deepen that branch of industry.
They could implement different types of wood, based on the tree it was cut from. Doing so, they may then do some other additions. For example, houses and furniture that heavily depend on wood could have an hue dependant to the type of wood used. According to the wood used, it would also be possible to have some bonuses in some regards. Some types are more tougher than others, for example, or better suited for different uses. For aesthetical purposes, the stalls could also sell some types of rare wood not usually found in america (ebony, for example).
In addition to this, trees could have different behaviours according to the biome (albeit something like a "climate" would be more appropriate, probably). Some could grow better in a biome, some worse, some maybe could not grow at all in some biomes. This would favor trading, in my opinion.

There is already a decay mechanic in place with stumps, why not add it to trees with a little randomness thrown in. Start with a chance for seedlings to sprout within a radius of mature trees. Mature trees have decay timer. Once they hit an event they are naturally felled. x amount of days they become hollow logs/ stumps. Then x amount of days they are gone. Would make the forests come alive and you already have some of the systems in place.

Also an axe made from oak will perform differntly then spruce. Maple, cherry, or mahogany would certainly be more desirable then pine for furniture. Sap or syrup could easily be added. This game has so much potential. We will see though if its realized or not.

[staxjax]

I moved the reforestation chat here.

[ArcaneCrisis]

A Couple of things different from H&H from my perspective that i miss:

☻ Turkeys have no quality, and are therefore not a growable industry.
☻ No animals can be tamed, and so meat stays at 1 quality.
☻ In order to make better soil, i need to farm. In order to make better food, i need to farm. In order to make better clothes, I need to farm.. Give me something else i can raise except crops and iron.
☻ only 1 ore (iron), only 1 minable level and no trolls :'(
☻ Its mainly land based, it was good to be able to travel down rivers into a lake and take a different exit. to forage, or to find people etc.. the rivers were essential.
☻ Half the proficiencies dont do anything useful (which i'm sure you'll change anyway) but with H&H you could raise Carp and therefore be incharge of making the best boards, or raise sewing and be a silker, or chef, or farmer, or hunter, or forager.. in this there is only farmers, miners and foragers. (less specialisation)
☻ Ranged Weapons are Terrible! (Slings and Rbows FTW)

Few things i like about salem in comparison to H&H:

☻Lagless for the most part (but H&H used to be)
☻ More forageables used in crafting.
☻ Being able to port to Boston for trades or stalls (like the Apples for oranges before it was raided) is cool, but stall prices and upkeep mean its not a market for newish players.. (elitist)
☻ Being able to shape the environment is cool.

I know its not dedicated to crafting.. but it all ties in

AC

[Banok]

NECRO

I recognize that the quality in Haven makes crafting more rewarding long term, but the argument that purity couldn't fill a similar function here is obviously erroneous, as the numbers boil down to a simple matter of scale. If purity 100, for example, were the equivalent of Q5k or even Q10k in Haven -- and correspondingly hard to achieve -- the problem of eventually maxing out obviously disappears, as those levels for all intents and purposes are practically unachievable in Haven as well.

The present farming purity is broken, quite simply, and should not be considered indicative of how the system will eventually come to play out.

As for the item types and their relations -- the nuts and bolts of actual crafting, if you will -- I would argue that Salem is in many ways superior to Haven.

coming back to salem I was really unimpressed to the state of purity, and was questioning the direction of the game. So I buried though jorbs post history hoping to find this pretty much exactly th.s post! awesome. very glad they are still planning to change purity, although disapointed its taking so long.

and yes havens q system was much better apart from the invisible node system as poteh points out.

[TeckXKnight]

coming back to salem I was really unimpressed to the state of purity, and was questioning the direction of the game. So I buried though jorbs post history hoping to find this pretty much exactly th.s post! awesome. very glad they are still planning to change purity, although disapointed its taking so long.

and yes havens q system was much better apart from the invisible node system as poteh points out.

The old system was bad and promoted a lot of activity that was not only detrimental to new players, but actively kicked them in the face. Anyone who found a lucky little spot and ground their purity up there was able to pump out insanely strong characters in only a few days. Everyone complains about that still being the case, but realistically you're consuming 4x as many goods for the same or lesser benefits so either you have to have 4x as much of everything or it's going to take significantly longer. 2 Weeks instead of 2 Days might not sound like a big deal, but it is when you think about a big raider recovering from a death. This length is slightly lessened through team-play in many cases but it's still significant.

[Dallane]

coming back to salem I was really unimpressed to the state of purity, and was questioning the direction of the game. So I buried though jorbs post history hoping to find this pretty much exactly th.s post! awesome. very glad they are still planning to change purity, although disapointed its taking so long.

and yes havens q system was much better apart from the invisible node system as poteh points out.

The old system was bad and promoted a lot of activity that was not only detrimental to new players, but actively kicked them in the face. Anyone who found a lucky little spot and ground their purity up there was able to pump out insanely strong characters in only a few days. Everyone complains about that still being the case, but realistically you're consuming 4x as many goods for the same or lesser benefits so either you have to have 4x as much of everything or it's going to take significantly longer. 2 Weeks instead of 2 Days might not sound like a big deal, but it is when you think about a big raider recovering from a death. This length is slightly lessened through team-play in many cases but it's still significant.

This^

grinding humors use to be ALOT easier. I was only on a 3.0 and 1.5 purity sharing with 5+ people and we had very high humors in a day or 2.

[Banok]

I never said I liked the old purity system, I infact completely agree with you why the old purity system was bad. see viewtopic.php?f=3&t=488

and yeah I hermited on 4.0 node with a new char and got 70 humours and all skills in a few days. but even as a new player unaware of purity nodes, game was less grindy back then.