Muslims Behead 4 year old girl

[Flame]

We should do the right thing

That's all i said. You deliberatly decided that i was debating if it's right or not to cut a head. Should i debate that?

I'm debating the right thing to do.

To me, the right thing is solve the problem at the origin.

If you think the problem is solved with a shot on those dudes head, you're satisfied easier than me.
I wish for more, and on a more large scale. A shot on their head is not enough to satisfy me.

You're not interested to read something different from what you expect.
I still think it's not hard to understand, though.

[Champie]

I still think it's not hard to understand, though.

I tried to tell Claeyt this a long time ago...

Don't waste your time "debating" these topics. If you are intelligent and thoughtful then you will know that there is nothing to gain from this futile exercise. Let Darwoth have his tiny pool of influence here, it is insignificant anyway.

[Flame]

It IS an exercise.

One day i'll have to debate with people in my country, but the mechanism are pretty much the same. I'm searching a possible way to break one's mind walls.
I'm testing some strategy in a foreign forum, so nothing is lost.
The language is a problem, yes, but the general mechanisms are pretty much the same.


On a side note: I have just see a dude laugh for a comic against him. A good drawing skill, a bunch of psychology and he will laugh even when you say he's frustrated, playing with people and poor died girls. I'm not that smart, i'm sure, but the world is too much simple, in a depressing way.
Even so, all i can do for that girls is to improve my skills at debating, so i'll go on.
Thanks for the advice.

[Darwoth]

and he still could not answer the question.

[Flame]

I did.
You just don't see it.

Do you have any friend that can help you and read this thread for you?
You can also quote what you don't understand, so that i can explain me better.

In case you've lost the discussion topic, is this one:

We should do the right thing. The problem, though, is about what we think is right.

By now, you should know what i think is right.
Have you missed it?

[Champie]

It IS an exercise.
Thanks for the advice.

You are exercising incorrectly. The "debate" you are having will cause you injury rather than build strength. This is a very common problem from physical exercise to intellectual pursuits. You will not get beneficial results by "exercising" the way you do here in the Salem forums.

Also, don't be stupid and think I am attacking you like the jackasses in this forum. I am trying to help you.

[Dallane]

Today I learned that flame supports child killers.

[Darwoth]

nope, sure didn't you completely dodged the question a half dozen times now while a retard runs interference in an effort to distract from that fact.

once again, this began when i was pointing out the disgusting act of muslims cutting a four year old girls head off, this is what you had to say.

Someone have died in a brutal way.
Or maybe not.
We should do the right thing anyway, since what's right is right always. Even when people don't die. Even when people die.

The problem, though, is about what we think is right and what we think is wrong. So we are exactly at the same point as before.

so your response to isis cutting a four year olds head off was "well thats just a big lie anyway!" and "so like we should do whats right man, but they think they are right so who is right?"

um, the side that does not decapitate toddlers? i never thought i would have to argue that point, but just ***** wow.

which is why my reply to you was this:

so you think it is debatable that cutting a four year olds head off is wrong?

what exactly would the right thing be to do in your eyes?

if the people involved were caught and proven guilty and you were the judge what would you do?

obviously bewildered by your statement i sought clarification because surely nobody could be debating whether a four year old being decapitated was the very definition of wrong and genuine evil. i then asked what you would do with those responsible given a judicial setting where all the choices lead back to you. you could have said you would execute them, could have taken the ***** route and jailed them and so on.

your reply was this:

Just to be sure, have you asked my opinion?
Are you sure you care to read what i write? For what i've seen, you hope that i write something like "i love murders".

As for now, i've never said so. Yet, you hope so hard for that.

If you're interested in my opinion, i will tell you.
Otherwise, put your favorite sentence you would read from me in this blank space: ________________________________ by Flame.
And play with it if you need a toy. ;P

you completely ***** avoided the question of "what would you do?" if you were given the relevance and power to do anything at all. instead you bloviate about nothing to deflect from the actual issue and post a picture instead.

so.......

what the ***** are you talking about? i did ask, you are skirting the question.

and once again you show me how your not avoiding the question by COMPLETELY AVOIDING THE QUESTION and instead posting this *****......

- Skirting the question? You know me so little. Don't answer at you is harder than stay silent. Share my opinion on important matters is what i care most. Even so, is always better to be sure the other is interested. You're not and you'll proof this, but let's just be positive as people think I am. So i'll imagine that you are interested.

I will tell you what i DON'T think would work to solve the situation.
The situation is not "a girl have been killed". The situation is ALL the situation, so ISIS and middle east.

Also, i'll let you know that I don't trust news.
This is irrelevant, though, since people is dying for sure. Maybe not always in that dramatic way, but indeed people are getting killed.

What America-Europe can do?

Bombs against them?
Won't work. Reasons below.

ISIS is a criminal organization. It's actually fighting the regular organization, as the nearest States and the common people.
A criminal organization don't have a specific army. It's mixed with common people, live in common places and is hidden. To bomb the ISIS you need to bomb public places, factories, the government itself.
This would kill a lot of common people. This would crush the few good organization and the government would collapse.
Only a few ISIS soldier would die, since they are scattered.
A lot of wounded civils would join ISIS against the evil American's Bombs.
In the end, you've gifted the state to the ISIS even more than now, with an improved army.
FAIL

Invasion with an army?
Won't work. Reasons below.

Invade with an army means that you have your army on foreign lands. All the states next to that land, are potentially endangered by your army. Most of the time your army means "i wanna conquer this side of the world" and lots of political-diplomacy problems comes out.
Plus, ISIS would not die, since is mixed with common people and can flee anytime.
Plus you kill civil people, so ISIS can enlist more desperate people and eat their brains.
American's army conquer a new country, destroy the government and let a state empty, so that ISIS can take it better than before.

Forcefully plant a democracy in their place?
Won't work. Reasons below.

A democracy is "The people will".
If you force the people to have a democracy, they don't know how to use it, since it's not their will.
The day after the democracy is on, they will vote someone that resemble what they find familiar.
Usually, that one is a dude that America don't like much, since he have born in a different culture and don't share the same values of America.
Democracy ends, your government call him a "dictator" and a new war is born.
This is what have happened many times before.

NOW, though, ISIS is stronger than usual, so the democracy would end in a ISIS dictator, which is worse.
FAIL.

If you think that some of these strategies could work in this situation, there is no chance you could agree with me.
If you think these are bad plans, i can share my idea further.

so now according to you the question is not the question i asked you several times that you refuse to answer, then you post moronic ***** about how the world should sit on their collective asses and sing kumbaya until the murderers of children decide to hold hands and join in the singing. whih by the way, none of which had a ***** thing to do with the question of again "what would you do then?" and "what is right in your opinion?"


so...........

and you are still completely avoiding the question to go spout nonsense about invading countries.

you said it was open to debate whether or not it was wrong to behead a four year old.

i asked for clarification and what you would do as the presiding judge over those responsible.

you reply with a cartoon and a bunch of ***** about invading muslim countries which was not the question.

and........

We should do the right thing

That's all i said. You deliberatly decided that i was debating if it's right or not to cut a head. Should i debate that?

I'm debating the right thing to do.

To me, the right thing is solve the problem at the origin.

If you think the problem is solved with a shot on those dudes head, you're satisfied easier than me.
I wish for more, and on a more large scale. A shot on their head is not enough to satisfy me.

You're not interested to read something different from what you expect.
I still think it's not hard to understand, though.

so now you once again avoid the question just like all the times previously.

"oh we should do the right thing, which i have not clarified in spite of being asked several times. but everyone should stop fighting the terrorists because that is definitely a wrong thing!"




you are beyond absurd and it is impossible for me to take any of the **** you say seriously after this, good to know you either support or are to much of a ***** to disapprove of murdering four year olds. are you a........ "moderate muslim"?

[saltmummy]

*sigh* Flame, I wish you would stop arguing about a system you've never lived under and have almost no experience with other than hear say and what you think you know. Two pages of "This is how it is." with you responding with "Is it how it is? How do you know? It might be that way, but maybe not."

Lets just start with:

Someone have died in a brutal way.
Or maybe not.

That. Clearly, someon DID die in a brutal way. There is no "maybe not" about it, as when a childs head has been removed from their shoulders they very naturally die. You can't go over and poke at the body with a stick saying "Are you dead? I don't know." There is no "maybe not" about such a death.

The problem, though, is about what we think is right and what we think is wrong.

If all this was simply about opinions and the other side wasn't randomly beheading people, you would be somewhat correct. The line between right and wrong is quiet a bit less flexible than that, even across multiple cultures. I'm sure Hitler thought he was the good guy too. That doesn't mean he was the good guy and it doesn't justify what his regime carried out just as ISIS own twisted sense of morality doesn't justify what they carry out. This isn't some debate where you fight with words and come away with little more than hurt feelings. It's a fight in which innocent people are killed because a mother made an empty threat, or a little boy because he was caught owning an American dollar, or a mans family because he was translating for soldiers and travelers. If believing that cutting peoples heads off is wrong, than I guess I'll be wrong because this isn't a video game and we aren't living in an apocalyptic world.

Today I learned that flame supports child killers.

I can say for sure that he doesn't, but it's very hard to convince anyone of that when he keeps talking as if he does.

Champie has given you advice which is more than sound. Withdraw from this discussion. I know your pride will probably keep you here, but your pride has no place here. Withdraw from this "debate" and save yourself the wasted effort. Knowing you, there is nothing you will learn here. The thread might as well have never happened for all the chance it will change anyones mind. Withdraw and save what respect this community might still have for you. I still have my respect for you, and it is because of that I am telling you, no, I am ordering you as your friend and as your "boss," withdraw now.

[Flame]

What i don't get is... What's worrying about this debating?
I know darwoth won't read what I write and he's not really used to think. I also know that I have nothing to "win" here.
These are not worrying things. I said it clearly, what i'm doing here is a bit of experimentation. A polite experimentation with no lies, about how to lead a man toward a direction subconsciously.
Actually, what i'm doing is foresee what he will say in the next post.
If i foresee correctly, i've learned something new.
If he surprise me, i have something new to learn.
That's all i can gain from a Salem topic, for now.

I am trying to help you.

Aya, sorry, that "thanks for the advice" must have sounded mean.
I appreciated your help and the fact that you cared about me. So, thanks for the advice, i appreciate it.
See? Debating teach me the most basic habits of speaking in english, so now i know that a "thanks for the advice" works well in a repository, but not in a debating. Now that you pointed that out, i can see why.
You were worried, I wasn't, so i've not paiyed attention of how you could read it when worried.

I also see that you (and salt) are too much worried for me.
Everything is fine. There's nothing to be worried here.
I would ask you more details about what's worry you and what darwoth could actually do against me, but i don't want to derail this topic too much.

In case you think i could end banned for some reason that i don't see, please let me know it. Sometime i wonder what's the "common sense" in this forum. I see that line crossed a thousands of time daily, so it's indeed a lot different than my common sense. I could end up crossing the line without notice it.
That's the only help i could accept, since a Ban is not in my list of "To do". ;D

Darwoth; Wait the next post (or an edit). Gotta work a bit.