San Bernardino Terrorism

[TotalyMeow]

They are NOT reporting this as a terrorist attack...YET. Only FOX news is calling it a terrorist attack. The shooters attacked their office Xmas party. I'm sure the guys religious views or workplace arguments had something to do with it but right now the FBI is saying that it wasn't an organized terrorist attack from any overseas source like ISIS.

Jakhollin said they were, and that was my summary of his opinion. In fact, they are saying they don't know the motive yet but that it was definitely a premeditated thing. Whether they meant to attack that party or had a different target in mind and made a last minute switch is also still unknown.

Yours and Darwoth's views on guns are not the normal view Americans have.

Not to be pedantic, but I don't believe I've ever given you my views on gun control.

Of course I'll finish an argument. I love arguing. Darwoth's rantings are not arguments. They're generally racist/fascist like rantings about how black people, arabic people, refugees, liberals who ever are destroying the world. I'm surprised you find them rational because most Americans would find them pretty strange and bizarre.

Sure you love arguing, that is clear, but you DON"T finish your arguments, you switch back and forth at a dizzying pace. You make a statement, someone else argues, you fail to rebut, but instead introduce a new topic entirely only to come back to the first topic several pages later and make some 'rebuttal' that often doesn't even make sense. Rational and reasonable are two entirely different things. I don't always agree with Darwoth or think his opinions are even remotely valid, but his arguments do hold together in a logical way and are consistent from one post or thread to the next. Yours tend to be all over the place and half the time even you don't seem to know what you're talking about. How can anyone agree with anyone who 'argues' like that? One looks insane by association.

Many people listen to me. I've gotten several PM's just today thanking me for arguing against Darwoth's (and apparently your) right wing nonsense. You're an admin, go into my Pm's and look at it.

What do you think this is, the KGB? It's called "Personal Message" for a reason, I can't read your mail, nor do I want to.

If these 'muslims' as you like to call them had pump-action shot guns and revolvers it would have been harder for them to kill so many, so quickly. This is why Assault weapons like AR-15's need to be illegal nation wide.

I don't 'like to call them' that, they were Muslim. I don't know much about fire rates of guns, so I can't argue about speed, but I do doubt you're right about numbers considering they had a captive room.

It does matter what gun is legal and what isn't. Look at Australia, look at Canada, look at any other country that has made these useless guns illegal and they don't have anything like what we have in gun violence.

Of course not, because there aren't as many guns around. Now make a comparison with all violence. Also, compare cultural tension, populations, population densities, police force size, economy, poverty rates, and all the other factors that are actually a part of this equation that you are entirely ignoring right now. But do it in another thread please.

Many of the restrictions of the Assault weapons ban of 1998 would be passable right now. They have been blocked by Republican leadership 3 times now from being put to a floor vote.

...If a bill can't even make it to a vote, it won't pass.

I never said, "Case Closed". Way to be simple minded Tmeow.

Way to not know what a summary is, doofus. Go ahead and quote what you did say, I think my summary was pretty accurate.

Right now it doesn't look like an ISIS attack or anything like that. It looks like some sort of crazy workplace shooting with religious overtones. Either way their easy access to guns made the rampage worse.

No, they're saying they don't know yet and that it could to either way or be both, which is far from declaring the negative. The very most recent reports have the pipe bombs using a recipe published in an ISIS magazine.

If it IS some sort of religious attack then so be it. I don't care about the 'Why' either way. I barely see any difference between this nut job shooting up his Xmas party with his wife, last weeks nut job shooting up a women's health clinic, or last months nut job shooting up his creative writing class in Oregon. They are all nut jobs who had easy access to guns and owned guns in this violent country with lax gun laws.

So, you don't care why this happened, you just want to push an anit-gun agenda whether it applies to the situation or would have helped it or not. Meh. The Democrats have been doing that all morning too. They're trying to get some anti-gun clause tacked on to a bill on an entirely different subject that they know Republicans are in favor of so they can either force a change on people who don't want it, or stop something beneficial that most people do want and then blame it on the other guys. So awful.

Why do you guys think Sanders is "pretending" to be a Republican. I can't think of anything sillier than to say that he's doing that.

It is very silly, but since no one ever said that, you're arguing against something imaginary.

I was worried about Chief/JC/Jwhitehorn. Also Slapacookie lives like 20 minutes from all this. It's important to remember that we're a 'community' Tmeow and that we should act like it. Why is it wrong for us to worry about our fellow Salemites when RL violence hits close to them?

I too am worried about John since I haven't heard from him in two days. This is not unusual and there is no reason he should have been anywhere near San Bernadino so my worries are almost certainly unfounded. I certainly never said it was wrong to worry, I said you are being a heartless ***** using this incident to push your 'JC is Chief' agenda, which you continue to do even now.

There weren't 3 shooters, just the man and his wife.

Yes, they've been saying that for several hours now.

I don't know why you think I care if it was 'Terrorism' or if he was Muslim, Tmeow and Darwoth.

Your arguments since the beginning of this thread have been; 1, that they either weren't Muslim or that their religion had nothing to do with whatever happened if they were; 2, that they weren't terrorists and this was a workplace shooting; and 3, that we should ban guns. So, you understand the confusion maybe when claim you don't care now about points 1 or 2 and never did. And I don't know what the hell you're arguing about now since your last two posts seem to have been just a long string of sentences stuck together with no particular point being made. And the word 'terrorism' does have an official definition.

Just to be clear, I think the general consensus of the people arguing with you is that terrorism is bad. There seems to be some opinion that the Islamic religion encourages the hatred of other religions. And no one is arguing that someone killing a doctor for performing an abortion is not a terrorist act.

[Claeyt]

They are NOT reporting this as a terrorist attack...YET. Only FOX news is calling it a terrorist attack. The shooters attacked their office Xmas party. I'm sure the guys religious views or workplace arguments had something to do with it but right now the FBI is saying that it wasn't an organized terrorist attack from any overseas source like ISIS.

Jakhollin said they were, and that was my summary of his opinion. In fact, they are saying they don't know the motive yet but that it was definitely a premeditated thing. Whether they meant to attack that party or had a different target in mind and made a last minute switch is also still unknown.

Well he apparently had some sort of argument at the party, went home, got his wife, dropped off his kid and then came back to the party in full gear like an hour later. They haven't released a timeline yet so we'll see.

Yours and Darwoth's views on guns are not the normal view Americans have.

Not to be pedantic, but I don't believe I've ever given you my views on gun control.

Well you seemed to be defending Darwoth's views so....

Of course I'll finish an argument. I love arguing. Darwoth's rantings are not arguments. They're generally racist/fascist like rantings about how black people, arabic people, refugees, liberals who ever are destroying the world. I'm surprised you find them rational because most Americans would find them pretty strange and bizarre.

Sure you love arguing, that is clear, but you DON"T finish your arguments, you switch back and forth at a dizzying pace. You make a statement, someone else argues, you fail to rebut, but instead introduce a new topic entirely only to come back to the first topic several pages later and make some 'rebuttal' that often doesn't even make sense. Rational and reasonable are two entirely different things. I don't always agree with Darwoth or think his opinions are even remotely valid, but his arguments do hold together in a logical way and are consistent from one post or thread to the next. Yours tend to be all over the place and half the time even you don't seem to know what you're talking about. How can anyone agree with anyone who 'argues' like that? One looks insane by association.

Try and keep up Tmeow, we're waaay past that now.

If these 'muslims' as you like to call them had pump-action shot guns and revolvers it would have been harder for them to kill so many, so quickly. This is why Assault weapons like AR-15's need to be illegal nation wide.

I don't 'like to call them' that, they were Muslim. I don't know much about fire rates of guns, so I can't argue about speed, but I do doubt you're right about numbers considering they had a captive room.

It sounds weird though. It's like if you kept calling the planned parenthood shooter Christian. Ex: A christian attacked a planned parenthood today. It sounds weird.

Many of the restrictions of the Assault weapons ban of 1998 would be passable right now. They have been blocked by Republican leadership 3 times now from being put to a floor vote.

...If a bill can't even make it to a vote, it won't pass.

It has the votes now according to the NY Times but the house leadership is blocking the bill so that the republicans won't have to vote for or against it in an election year.

If it IS some sort of religious attack then so be it. I don't care about the 'Why' either way. I barely see any difference between this nut job shooting up his Xmas party with his wife, last weeks nut job shooting up a women's health clinic, or last months nut job shooting up his creative writing class in Oregon. They are all nut jobs who had easy access to guns and owned guns in this violent country with lax gun laws.

So, you don't care why this happened, you just want to push an anit-gun agenda whether it applies to the situation or would have helped it or not. Meh. The Democrats have been doing that all morning too. They're trying to get some anti-gun clause tacked on to a bill on an entirely different subject that they know Republicans are in favor of so they can either force a change on people who don't want it, or stop something beneficial that most people do want and then blame it on the other guys. So awful.

I want to push a gun-law agenda because this was a mass shooting that could have been prevented or minimized with national gun restrictions. I care that people are dying and we as a country don't seem to want to prevent the next mass shooting, if it's at a women's health clinic, a mosque or if it's some muslim nut job who hates America.

I was worried about Chief/JC/Jwhitehorn. Also Slapacookie lives like 20 minutes from all this. It's important to remember that we're a 'community' Tmeow and that we should act like it. Why is it wrong for us to worry about our fellow Salemites when RL violence hits close to them?

I too am worried about John since I haven't heard from him in two days. This is not unusual and there is no reason he should have been anywhere near San Bernadino so my worries are almost certainly unfounded. I certainly never said it was wrong to worry, I said you are being a heartless ***** using this incident to push your 'JC is Chief' agenda, which you continue to do even now.

Okay, okay. I don't care if JC is Chief or not now. I don't have a 'JC is Chief' agenda. I just thought it was common knowledge. Now you've got me worried worried to Tmeow. JC check your game's forum. Cookie's okay, I talked to him last night.

[Darwoth]

talking to claeyt is like walking headfirst into a wall with a door painted on it, the rest of you folks have fun with him

i did enjoy meows summary, simple and straightforward.

as to the shootings the more information comes to light the more obvious this guy was yet another radicalized muslim.


edit: also, just for good measure.....

If these 'muslims' as you like to call them had pump-action shot guns and revolvers it would have been harder for them to kill so many, so quickly.

ed mcgivern and this random guy in his backyard disagree.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXhLbTPAJRs

[Dallane]

I love it when Cleaty says that a majority of Americans want gun control when that couldn't be further from the truth. With the amount of guns in this country you are in fact not going to stop mass shootings. There would be MASSIVE blow back to anyone actually trying to take guns away. The more he talks the more you can see his damaged mental state.

[Rubberduckbandit]

Funny how Claeyt claims he is right, and everyone wants what he says, but there are pages on here with no one agreeing with him and a handful of people calling him an idiot, and out on his bs lies. How he isn't banned for openly supporting terrorism, and selective racism is beyond me.

[Judaism]

Lol he got outnumbered heavily, not that American inhabitants would shoot someone down as easy. Especially not with the people density.

[Father Latour]

I love it when Cleaty says that a majority of Americans want gun control when that couldn't be further from the truth. With the amount of guns in this country you are in fact not going to stop mass shootings. There would be MASSIVE blow back to anyone actually trying to take guns away. The more he talks the more you can see his damaged mental state.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/186236/ameri ... yndication

The most recent political polling does not support you.

[Tulgarath]

I love it when Cleaty says that a majority of Americans want gun control when that couldn't be further from the truth. With the amount of guns in this country you are in fact not going to stop mass shootings. There would be MASSIVE blow back to anyone actually trying to take guns away. The more he talks the more you can see his damaged mental state.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/186236/ameri ... yndication

The most recent political polling does not support you.

Looks like its all over the place, but on many occasions, the more strict group is actually outnumbered by the less strict and keep as it is groups.

[Claeyt]

Looks like its all over the place, but on many occasions, the more strict group is actually outnumbered by the less strict and keep as it is groups.

It actually gets much higher when you break it down into the individual things the Democrats are trying to pass like Background checks for all gun sales (92%) or Not allowing people on the Federal Terror watch list to buy guns (77%).

http://www.pollingreport.com/guns.htm

[Darwoth]

"polls" are a joke, i have participated in dozens of polls. none of those polls ever got published because they did not jive with the agenda, so they would do **** like call people in a different area of the country to get a different result.

then take into account the majority of those polled are given ***** trigger questions "do you think its good for TERRORISTS TO BUY GUNS?!?!?!"

"no way man!"

and so that means you must be in favor of gun control

as evidenced in this thread the people like claeyt **** LIES out of their mouths, and the reality is that john q public is an uneducated moron that does not know he is being taken for a ride, claeyt came on here to tell us all about how you can just hop onto ebay and buy all the guns you want because while completely untrue he has likekly never been called on it the last 20 times he ***** someone about it.

the reason people on the "no fly" list are not barred from buying guns is because the "no fly list" is a fairly recent development and there are metric ***** tons of people on it most of whom have no reason to be. it also does not require anything other than some ***** pencil pusher saying you should be on it to be added, no warrant, no crime, no nothing you can be added to it at anytime, they used to use your ***** CREDIT HISTORY as a factor. thus the very next thing that will happen were the "no fly list" a prohibited condition is that the liberals would start using it as a tool to not only harass innocent americans with their travel but their right to bear arms as well.

background checks are required for gun purchases in every example except for an in county or in state private sale, which in most locations is restricted to a handful per year and is usually at a gun show with about 2 dozen state police troopers 4 feet away watching everything your doing and whom will crawl up your ass if you even LOOK suspicious, this is because bob nob does not have the ability to hit the NICS system and we do not care to gut a hundred and fifty years of american tradition, particularly when this has no affect on anything anyway.

they also clamor about "mentally ill people can buy guns!!!!" well no, they cant. that is a prohibited condition. what the truth is is that they want to have PTSD added to the "mental illness" clause so that they can instantly turn hundreds of thousands of our military veterans into prohibitied persons given that PTSD is massively over diagnoses (it is like the add fad of the late 90s ) and again, is not something with hard proof, meaning any crackpot liberal psychologist can decided to disarm someone.

an example. you a female? got knocked up and got prescribed some happy pills to manage your hormones? well claeyt wants you to not be allowed to buy a gun anymore under the "mental illness" they seek to redefine.

no thanks.


it is just like the gay agenda, it is all about push push pushing on every front even nonsensical ones until they have a 100 different ways to interfere in your life.

liberals are nothing if not liars and snakes in the grass, they obfuscate the truth and invent fantasy to support their unreality, and they can never be content living their lives because they are usually a disaster, so instead they seek to control yours and everyone elses. they want to tell you what kind of car you can drive, who you have to hire, that you cant own a gun, what you can say, take your money to redestribute it according to their ideals and on and on it goes.

the reason they HATE private gun ownership is the exact reason we have private gun ownership enshrined in our constitution, so that american citizens have the ability to kill all of them when they go to far in their quest for a totalitarian nanny state.