Thrive movement

[Syndarn]

..you're going to need to know what you're talking about.

Can't argue with you there, your'e right. And i can't say i know how to present the energy matter, in such way that it would be beliavable. Just saying that there might be potential in this.

Only thing i can say is that i am quite certain the pmh is the key to "free energy" and many other things.
Then you ask why? Well based upon stories how E.L supposedly built his coral castle. And that hes patent application was rejected. I wonder why? Well back in those days N.Tesla was alive and was funded by J.P. Morgan. One could conclude that it might have been him that had something do do with it. So Morgan shuts down Tesla and makes sure E.L work never sees the light of day and rides the moneywagon with Edison. Just a theory .. anyway moving on.

So the question is how did he lift his coral stones? When the heaviest one weighs almost 30 tons. That's a huge amount.
In the modern day you would need Liebherr LTM 1030 crane for that.
Pretty sure they didn't have many cranes available back then in 1920 and if they did, did it really lift that much? (was there even a mobile version that could lift that much?). No one ever saw him rent and use one. So it's a mystery.

The story is the same as with Tesla. Someone confiscated his research and destroyed what was left in his castle. So there is very little evidence left behind, to try to figure out how he did it.

Well in the end it's just wild stories. As far as i know no one has proven how he did it, it's just theories wich describe he used methods, a modern day scientist would say lol and don't take the matter seriously. Well no one is any wiser.

So there is still a big ?

[Tamasin]

actually the coral castle dude has been debunked, i don't remember the details since i didn't find it very interesting.

Tesla is an interesting case

[Syndarn]

What? really? .. if you have a link to a explanation you accepted please send.

[Tamasin]

really. i'm too tired to remember much now let alone the source.

iirc basically there were various misconceptions that arose about the castle while actually it was not so difficult for him to do.

[Syndarn]

Alright, well if you happen to have a spare moment tomorrow, and want to find it for me, please do send the info my way.
In the meantime I will look for it abit on my own, and see what i can dig up.

EDIT: If you mean this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJ8n_HU0vP0, ive seen it before, but i don't accept it.
It's not that simple. Some of the blocks are quite high up and there would not be much space to move them around or close to the structures. First I don't see a concrete floor anywhere that would hold hold the weight of a 30 ton block, let alone focus it on a small point in the middle so you can turn it around without it sinking into the earth. Most stones crack under smaller pressures. He could have used iron ofc. Not to mention the amount of space you need to use the board methods to lift the blocks up, and use the turning method while on top of the "planklifter". Ok, he could have used a metal as the last "board" .. othervise the balance stone would just drill right into the planks. Going that high makes the whole lift very unstable in general and you would have to make it quite wide and big so it doesn't fall. In my view the probability that he pulled it off using these techniques is very small.

Even if he did that doesn't explain the story about the coral shipment, how he unloaded the truck by himself in a very short time, and cleaned up afterwards so the truck drivers weren't any wiser.

[Jalpha]

Source energy/zero point energy it has many names, it does exist. I think we can all agree that much. So if it exist and is abundant around us, the idea of tapping into it is not delusional. It's more of a challenge.

Fusion power also exists, is much better understood and is further along in it's research and development. You and I will likely still not see fusion energy in our lifetimes. Developing an entirely new and wholly exotic source of power which may or may not work at all is just... A giant step backwards.

There is no time. We need changes which can be put in place in the near future and which do not destabilise society. If you neglect either of those points you cannot get support from the majority of the population, and it would be retarded to try.

If you look into the number of people employed in the existing energy industry, and also take into account all the industry which exists solely to support it... You are talking about loss of jobs on a scale so epic it would literally cripple society. Manufacturing, transportation, aviation, mining, environmental assessment and management, technicians, engineers, scientists... Just no. You are talking about trying to rebuild from a post apocalypse where money doesn't work anymore. That's a ***** dangerous idea and I wholly support any government for preventing it from happening.

Humanity is not ready for the utopia you desire. We need to be prepared, and the change must be gradual. Accept that and do something about it, I want no part in any revolution, particularly not one founded largely in the realm of fantasy and headed by a crackpot.

Magnets are magical, and not well understood. Could they be used to create endless free energy? Potentially yes. Potentially no.

[Syndarn]

Fusion power also exists, is much better understood and is further along in it's research and development.

True, fusion is the most probable next in line good energy source.

There is no time. We need changes which can be put in place in the near future and which do not destabilise society. If you neglect either of those points you cannot get support from the majority of the population, and it would be retarded to try.

Well it is probable that humanity takes the long road in this, we have always done it. I don't disagree that we need some good solutions right now. We already have some that work, but they mostly work with solar and are only efficient where there is alot of sun. I live up north so i can't really rely on that much. Windpower works, but im not really comfortable with that. I find them disturbing the landscape picture and then they are noisy.

If you look into the number of people employed in the existing energy industry, and also take into account all the industry which exists solely to support it... You are talking about loss of jobs on a scale so epic it would literally cripple society. Manufacturing, transportation, aviation, mining, environmental assessment and management, technicians, engineers, scientists... Just no. You are talking about trying to rebuild from a post apocalypse where money doesn't work anymore. That's a ***** dangerous idea and I wholly support any government for preventing it from happening.

The energy industry would have work for many years to come people would still need gas for their cars, until they have a chance to buy or mod it for something better. The change would be gradual as you wanted, it can't be fast even if one would try. You just don't re-fit hundreds of millions of cars with electrical engines overnight, or mod households so they have their own powersources. (the goverment would probably tell you it's dangerous and forbid it anyways, or then put a insane tax on it) Not to mention the other stuff like transporting goods/food/clothes. The need of the technicians for energy system development would still be there, they would just have to adapt. Oil and stuff is still used for fertilizers and other goods. I don't see why you should be so scared of this. Just do it.

Accept that and do something about it

Already ahead of you. I have a 15 hectare farm at home that grows organic food, wich i sell. Not very profitable but it helps abit, and on the top side i know exactly what i eat. Clean water i can get from our spring. Basically i only need to figure out my energy problem and i don't need to rely on society anymore, atleast not that heavily. I would still need to use money to get things i can't make at home or if i run out of something. So i can't abandon money alltogether. But id have alot more to go around when i can skip most of the foodbill and all of the energy and waterbills, so i wouldn't need to work that hard, so i'd have more time to do other things.

[Jalpha]

Well it is probable that humanity takes the long road in this, we have always done it. We already have some that work, but they mostly work with solar and are only efficient where there is alot of sun. Windpower works, but im not really comfortable with that.

Wind siphons energy out of the environment, as does solar, and on a large enough scale they will interfere with natural weather systems. Additionally their footprint through all stages of production, operation and replacement doesn't make them as environmentally friendly or as carbon neutral as everyone is led to believe.

Things happen slowly because people resist change and like being comfortable. There's nothing wrong with stepping stones.

The change would be gradual as you wanted, it can't be fast even if one would try. You just don't re-fit hundreds of millions of cars with electrical engines overnight, or mod households so they have their own powersources. (the goverment would probably tell you it's dangerous and forbid it anyways, or then put a insane tax on it) Not to mention the other stuff like transporting goods/food/clothes. The need of the technicians for energy system development would still be there, they would just have to adapt. Oil and stuff is still used for fertilizers and other goods. I don't see why you should be so scared of this. Just do it.

I wholeheartedly disagree with a just do it mentality. Show me an effective business model for transitioning to this hypothetical energy source which doesn't even have a working example yet. I'm wondering at this point why I am arguing so far ahead when there is still such a basic failure in the possibility of this eventuality, yet still...

I'm concerned that you are so blase, and I suspect this is because you are substantially underestimating the number of people who work in energy related areas who will be unable to transition to a new system. I suspect you are also substantially underestimating the impact in other areas as well... There will be a huge drop in demand in transportation when nobody has to move coal around for example. Moving clothing around will not make up the difference.

This is still much further along in the argument than we should be. The Thrive movement is a negative thing, I fail to see how anyone can't see through such an obvious underlying agenda.

Look into the LFTR. I'll even provide a link. From my perspective it seems like the single most viable and (and I emphasize this) proven option for efficient energy production in the medium term.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lG1YjDdI_c8

This is just scratching the surface. Energy is not going to be the primary concern as we head into the next 100 years.

[Claeyt]

Wind siphons energy out of the environment, as does solar, and on a large enough scale they will interfere with natural weather systems. Additionally their footprint through all stages of production, operation and replacement doesn't make them as environmentally friendly or as carbon neutral as everyone is led to believe.

This is just scratching the surface. Energy is not going to be the primary concern as we head into the next 100 years.

Both of these statements make no sense.

Yes Wind and Solar siphon energy from the environment. Wind energy blocks wind I suppose and Solar blocks the sun from warming what ever surface it should of hit but both of those are so insignificant as to be meaningless for the energy collected. If you mean they affect animal life then that's a different statement.

Non-use of energy sources would be the most carbon neutral but wind, hydro and solar are as carbon neutral as industrial energy output can be right now.

If energy sources aren't going to be the primary concern for the next 100 years than what is, and don't say water. De-salination technologies are much further along than clean energy. Food is a product of energy and transportation. I suppose there's an argument for global warming but that also is a product of energy development.

[Jalpha]

American pls go...