Is it a time for open beta? - Thoughts 'bout bank and mail.

[jwhitehorn]

The Great Spirit has stated numerous times that this is not working as intended. The last time The Great Spirit spoke about a known mechanic he didn't like and "let go" for awhile until it became norm was the 1x1 Fields and fields in Mines. For months we all knew we shouldn't do it and he didn't like it. However, it still became mainstream. Then, one day, BOOM... All fields of both types were just gone. All influence, seeds, crops, etc wasted. Perhaps some got more value out of those fields before they lost them, perhaps some losing all their T3 fields wasn't worth the benefit of having them in the mine in the first place. Either way it was a huge risk and those who didn't do it were better for it in the end.

Alt-Vaulting is the same thing here and the Tribe doesn't do it for the same reason. One day they will be gone. The Great Spirit will either delete 5 humour chars with full inventories, Limit accounts to 10 characters and just keep your 10 highest, or the preferred method which is allow characters without leanto's to be larceny'd from Boston and characters WITH leanto's to be larceny'd from the leanto. When this happens every alt-vault will be stripped of everything on it in an instant and the same analysis as above will need to be ran. Was having that easy storage worth losing ALL of it some day? To those who alt-vaulted for months and then used it all, they will get away clean. But for those caught with alt-vaults, prepare to lose everything for your mechanic abuse.

inb4tears of "you didn't warn me I could lose all my stuff on alts" thread.

Chief PeePooKaKa
MM Tribe

[Kandarim]

stuff

the least the greater spirit could do in those cases is give us a purse that will hold a decent amount of silver. 7.5k just doesn't cut it, leading to altvaults just to store silver ...

As I point out: I use altvaults for most of my storage needs, because they're simply much more tractable and scalable than huge plots of land devoted to cupboards where I get lost. IF altvaults were ever to get nerfed (which won't happen anytime soon, none of the solutions proposed so far make any sense - contrary to 1x1 fields or mine fields where the fix was straightforward) then yes, I'd lose a lot of stuff. Too bad. I'll go with that option over losing all of the stuff + the discomfort of large storage units when someone raids my base.

[jwhitehorn]

the least the greater spirit could do in those cases is give us a purse that will hold a decent amount of silver. 7.5k just doesn't cut it, leading to altvaults just to store silver ...

You could store your silver in purses in boxes like so many others who I find when I help myself to their base. You CHOOSE to alt-vault it because you don't want to take a risk of leaving it locked in a chest somewhere in your base. That is fine. But I'm simply pointing out that you are in fact taking the risk that you will be quicker than me when The Great Spirit opens up the option to larceny alt-vaults. Assuming he doesn't determine an acceptable way to just poof them entirely. Its risky either way. I feel alt-vaulting is WAY more risky than just leaving silver in a box in my base. You obviously feel otherwise.

As I point out: I use altvaults for most of my storage needs, because they're simply much more tractable and scalable than huge plots of land devoted to cupboards where I get lost. IF altvaults were ever to get nerfed (which won't happen anytime soon, none of the solutions proposed so far make any sense - contrary to 1x1 fields or mine fields where the fix was straightforward) then yes, I'd lose a lot of stuff. Too bad. I'll go with that option over losing all of the stuff + the discomfort of large storage units when someone raids my base.

It seems you have weighed the pros vs. cons and have determined that alt-vaulting is still the best risk vs. reward. That is good. My PSA was mainly for people who didn't realize that it is only a matter of time before alt-vaults are lost, as long as they still find benefit with that fact then good for them.

Also... What is wrong with Larceny from a Leanto and Larceny from Town in the event the player has no leanto? I found that to be a very amicable solution and I can assure you The Great Spirit and I have discussed it on more than one occasion.

Chief PeePooKaKa
MM Tribe

[Darwoth]

alt vaulting is pathetic and ***** up the integrity of the game, i have no confidence it will ever be resolved however due the fact it is still an issue in haven 5 years after people started ***** about it.

[Darwoth]

also i got a heary guffaw out of kandarim alt vaulting worthless **** like garlic and indian cotton

[Kandarim]

also i got a heary guffaw out of kandarim alt vaulting worthless **** like garlic and indian cotton

which was my example to prove that I use it more as a conveniently sorted storage than as a safe place to store stuff.

Also... What is wrong with Larceny from a Leanto and Larceny from Town in the event the player has no leanto? I found that to be a very amicable solution and I can assure you The Great Spirit and I have discussed it on more than one occasion.

How would that work, exactly? Could you then only rob from altvaults you have memorized? In that case, most of mine will be safe until I bother emptying them.
Aside from that, I don't quite like the possibility that you could completely destroy someone unprovokedly. As the next step, you'll be clamouring for everyone to remain online on log-out, so we can all be murdered whenever our defences are penetrated ?

[jwhitehorn]

How would that work, exactly? Could you then only rob from altvaults you have memorized? In that case, most of mine will be safe until I bother emptying them.
Aside from that, I don't quite like the possibility that you could completely destroy someone unprovokedly. As the next step, you'll be clamouring for everyone to remain online on log-out, so we can all be murdered whenever our defences are penetrated ?

No, You would be provided a list of all characters with an inventory and no homestead from some NPC/Stone in Boston.. You could then Larceny from that list. And this would destroy nobody who isn't exploiting the game via alt-vaults unprovoked or not. I couldn't steal from anybody unless I was either A) at their leanto or B) they have no homestead and are logged off. This would once again prove to be a mechanic that would ONLY punish those who were going out of their way to break the rules... Similar to the 1x1 fields.

Chief PeePooKaKa
MM Tribe

[Kandarim]

I couldn't steal from anybody unless I was either A) at their leanto

My point: at that point, you can steal from them if you have evidence for them, which means they have provoked you (or someone else).

Aside from that, such a list would be incredibly resource-consuming, in my mind. I alone have altvaults and scouts numbering probably over a thousand by now, others surely have even more.

[jwhitehorn]

My point: at that point, you can steal from them if you have evidence for them, which means they have provoked you (or someone else).

Aside from that, such a list would be incredibly resource-consuming, in my mind. I alone have altvaults and scouts numbering probably over a thousand by now, others surely have even more.

Each time one lost its entire inventory it would be removed from the list as one of the perquisites is that an alt have an inventory to appear on such a list. As such, the list would be massive for exactly one day. At that point, I and/or others who wish to protect the integrity of the game and its mechanics, would remove the inventories from these thousands of alts, place them in boxes, and check the list daily to make sure it is empty. POOF Alt-Vaulting over, Game now working as intended with no banking system.

Chief PeePooKaKa
MM Tribe

[Amour_Vulpes]

-Scissors.-

I agree 110%. Hell, why can't we just make it where you require the current scents to summon kill someone but have it by default that the person's inventory can be summoned to be stolen. The fact that person B has gotten into person A's base to steal anything should not be limited to everything laying around except the lento's that may be used as alternative account vaults. It is piratically the same thing as having an understandable vault in H&H. Complete *****! While this might be a minor aspect now, it does need to be dealt with in the future.