My god

[JohnCarver]

While it is fun to rewrite history or attempt to manipulate it to push a game design agenda there are simply cold hard server stats that contradict most if not all the discontent when comparing the days of yesteryear to the days of now.

My 2 Cents on the subject:

*The idea that the score of the scalp matters, is simply dumb. I would remind the general public that not that long ago there WAS NO score of the scalp, thus it was the thrill of the chase, the fun of the hunt and as several have pointed out the words of the story teller that kept the community engaged in drama here on the forums. I agree with Meow 100% that it is the lack of the storyteller that is missing, not any of the other things. Judiasm makes a good point that he has contributed to the drama, but as pointed out by himself he doesn't necessarily 'enjoy' making the posts. Darwoth has pointed out that he is too busy running his one man army to show the wealth of drama I watch him partake in weekly if not daily on the server logs. The rest of you, well, I watch all the general nonsense you get yourselves into, as to why you choose not to share? IDK. But it is certainly a lack of sharing, not a lack of 'doing'.

*Murders and permadeaths are just silly in comparison to the old system and are easily 1000% higher.

*Deaths of top 10 Characters are 'similar'. The biggest difference is that top 10 characters tend to kill themselves before landing on the scalp board, then keep their own scalps for themselves. This means that the attacker doesn't have his trophy and the drama doesn't get posted. Arguably a fix should be explored here but it doesn't change the fact FAR more high scalp score players have died post raiding patch than pre-raiding patch. Maybe those players are just YOLOing mains before they quit? Because there is a point that Mains 'should' be generally safer after the raiding patch if you build the right base and keep your nose clean.

*The highest value raiding hits and just sheer volume of goods looted is also a silly magnitude higher than it has ever been on providence.

*The number of crimes committed are higher than they have ever been on providence.

*The #1 Town has been 'assaulted' since the changes, the last time the #1 Town in Salem was brought any level of confrontation was December of 2013 ending a 2 year 'streak' of the 'top dog' living with immunity from confrontation.


I could go on and on and on. But if I wasn't getting a HEALTHY HEALTHY dose of entertainment and drama on a daily/weekly basis watching hte events unfold on server traffic I would drop everything I am doing and change my focus back to PVP. There is quite simply no 'patch' that is going to force people to be creative, egotistical, or 'braggers'. The major pot stir'ers seem to like to keep their tears to themselves (and me through server logs). While that is unfortunate to the community at large there is very little I intend to do about the fact that most drama doesn't get shared.

It could always be better, so I'll kepe looking for ideas to make the drama even juicier. But every patch somebody 'dies' in a new and exciting way I anticipated. Pushing people off hte boston claim when they go AFK to permakill them was intended from the very second I put it in the game. And it has happened on more than one occasion to characters FAR larger and more noteworthy than the average deaths pre-raiding patch. I think only Heffernan's death has been made public from it, but regardless, each patch you'll have fun new creative ways to kill each other and cause drama. If you choose to share it, its up to you.

[Hose]

actual pvp is like: ko with main - kill with an alt

[JohnCarver]

Murder alts have always been a thing. I don't expect that to ever change. 99% of my murders were done on a murder alt long before I ever assumed development of Salem. The DIFFERENCE is that NOW the murder alt has a high chance of death, AND represents either 300+ Cloak OR $7.50 store investment. BEFORE my murder alts took me about 15 minutes and I threw them away like candy.

[RobertoKarlos]

I think the only one that can be blamed is the new salem comunity, JC is doing a good roll as dev, but people insist on being carebears and ******.

[Judaism]

*Deaths of top 10 Characters are 'similar'. The biggest difference is that top 10 characters tend to kill themselves before landing on the scalp board, then keep their own scalps for themselves. This means that the attacker doesn't have his trophy and the drama doesn't get posted. Arguably a fix should be explored here but it doesn't change the fact FAR more high scalp score players have died post raiding patch than pre-raiding patch. Maybe those players are just YOLOing mains before they quit? Because there is a point that Mains 'should' be generally safer after the raiding patch if you build the right base and keep your nose clean.

That might be the reason, I haven't seen many new entries in the top 10 list ever since. On the contrary with the new inspirationals and such it should be much, much more common to have a character in that list than before.

*The highest value raiding hits and just sheer volume of goods looted is also a silly magnitude higher than it has ever been on providence.

Yes, back then it was certainly never going about the loot, it is good that raiding can be quite profitable now, but it has different intentions now than before.

*The number of crimes committed are higher than they have ever been on providence.

I feel thats unfair, as pointed out above the intentions are different now. On top of that its easier now to commit more crimes, with the implementation of the lootable homesteads, that also adds up in amount of loot.

The major pot stir'ers seem to like to keep their tears to themselves (and me through server logs). While that is unfortunate to the community at large there is very little I intend to do about the fact that most drama doesn't get shared.

Agreed.

But every patch somebody 'dies' in a new and exciting way I anticipated.

True, sadly that is very limited after other people discover or hear about it, it also relies on continue progess on the game.

Then again, I am not really complaining about the drama, I do however expect that almost all of the Salem drama will rely on the expeditions, rather than Providence.

[JohnCarver]

My stance is not one against 'improvement'. But to go forward I think we do need to acknowledge the reality that further improvement in no way resembles anything close to what we had.

[Judaism]

My stance is not one against 'improvement'. But to go forward I think we do need to acknowledge the reality that further improvement in no way resembles anything close to what we had.

Perhaps its misplaced however with many games you see that the people liked the game more previously.

Take World of Warcraft and Runescape for example, both having new servers as how it used to be back in the days.

[Mr_Bellflower]

Eh, Salem lost the magic when Jorb & Loaf left. It'll never get it back in my opinion. I'd be more interested in how many will stay here when H&H 2.0 is released in compassion to those who started in Salem.

[Judaism]

Eh, Salem lost the magic when Jorb & Loaf left. It'll never get it back in my opinion. I'd be more interested in how many will stay here when H&H 2.0 is released in compassion to those who started in Salem.

Thats rude, Salem has become much and much better. There is no doubt for me, even tho I disagree with many new mechanics. That does not mean that they aren't better for the game in the long run, the new patches brought so much more dept and fun.

With Jorb and Loftar the game would had been finally released already and all those new features woudn't even be implemented. People would be bored much quicker than they are now and the expeditions can bring alot of joy for many other people, it will likely not include me tho.

[JohnCarver]

Take World of Warcraft and Runescape for example, both having new servers as how it used to be back in the days.

Indeed I find it an interesting phenonmenon that even I myself go to. However, I typically feel I have a distinct point of game design change that I can point to say "THIS" is why I liked the game better before.

WoW, for example, was a FAR better game when PVP was 'outside' and not in some instance that didn't have any real bearing on the real world.


I would concede entirely to anybody who hates Dock Club, The Public Map, Landmarks, Increased forage rates, Increased run speed. Because a part of me hates those things too but the 'good' still feels like it outweighs the 'bad' without them. But the general "pvping was funner" with no real central focus as to 'why' is more attributed to nostalgia. ALL games are more fun when they are new, fresh, and exploration is abound. There is nothing I'm going to do to cause pvp veterans to 'unlearn' everything they know about Salem and how it works, thus I will never bring back the nostalgia, nor would I want to.

That being said, I think the population, scents, and DRAMA taking place speak for themselves that the 'new' Salem experience far outweights the 'old' salem experience for those who find it for hte first time. Another fun statistic I see thrown around is that Salem has reached some level of market saturation in the past and that we must 'win over' veterans going forward or previous users so that they come back.

That could not be farther from the truth on where we are going. Approx 150,000 people downloaded Salem since its creation. A fair number of people to be sure BUT

12.5 Million Players have subscribed to WOW at a singular point in time.

700 Million Players play online video games.

Meaning 1.2% of WoW's market share has given Salem a chance and an insignificant amount of the gaming population as a whole has given Salem a chance.

It would be lovely if previous Salem player base gave us another shot and enjoyed themselves. It would also be nice if current Salem Playerbase saw what we were doing and preferred it. But NEITHER of those demographics are our target. We took up Salem planning to 'change' it into the landscape we always hoped and wished it would be. We still strongly believe there are others like us who want to play on that same landscape, and that somewhere in the 699 Million Gamers who have not tried us yet, there exists 20,000 that think our idea of a good game, is theirs too.