Alchemical Mastery

[Hardsun]

Since you got fertilizers from foragebles witch happens all to be at 0% how would you get good fertilizers ?

[Sevenless]

Since you got fertilizers from foragebles witch happens all to be at 0% how would you get good fertilizers ?

Crops have a random +/- in concentrations that leads to small gains in purity if you only plant the highest purity ones.

[Potjeh]

Crop purity has nothing to do with fertilizers.

[Hardsun]

Crop purity has nothing to do with fertilizers.

Hmm i thought fertilizer elements affect crops alchemical elements...

[Potjeh]

They don't, confirmed by Loftar.

[Hardsun]

So how do we get crops whith desired elements if we dont have a way to influence on it ? Just useing crops deviation in purity and replanting again and again ?

[Potjeh]

Yup.

[Chiprel]

Crop purity has nothing to do with fertilizers.

Hmm i thought fertilizer elements affect crops alchemical elements...

They don't, confirmed by Loftar.

Recent discussion with loftar(log from irc -few days pre-wipe):


[23:10] <KarlHurtig> Is there any possibility in getting any further insight in how the random factor is applied in the crop alchemic composition? From what I read from other people, land composition and seed composition matters, but how it is applied more strictly? For instance, what is the highest difference in mercury assuming a seed with 50 mercry, 25 lad and 25 salt is plant
[23:10] <KarlHurtig> ed?
[23:10] <KarlHurtig> mercury*, lead*
[23:12] <loftar> Well, each element simply gets a random number between -5 and 5 added, and the elements are then recanonicalized.
[23:12] <loftar> Or renormzalized might be a better word.
[23:13] <KarlHurtig> o.o
[23:13] <loftar> renormalized*
[23:13] <KarlHurtig> when you say "5", you mean 50 -> 55? where 100 is max? (Just checking that I got the scaling correctly)
[23:13] <loftar> Yeah
[23:14] <KarlHurtig> ok thx a lot
[23:14] <loftar> Was that particularly surprising, though?
[23:14] <KarlHurtig> All numbers between -5 and 5 are equally probable?
[23:14] <loftar> Yes.
[23:15] <KarlHurtig> Well, given that your S&C bonus when planting does not follow a "nice" distribution, yes, it was surprising XD
[23:15] <loftar> I don't see that it's necessary here.
[23:15] <loftar> Given the renormalization.
[23:16] <loftar> It's far from obvious that a non-linear stochastic distribution would even make it harder.
[23:16] <KarlHurtig> yeah, I will probably do probability analysis for how hard it is to raise purity multiplier later on
[23:16] <staxjax> how come people that have started new crops after the node wipe, with ****** p1 seeds still have ****** crops
[23:16] <KarlHurtig> Staxjax: because they mix the seeds in seed bags.
[23:16] <loftar> Because they don't grind purity and simply combine their seeds, staxjax?
[23:17] <staxjax> well, I know that all my crops are increasing/decreasing randomly in sulphur
[23:17] <loftar> In all elements, actually.
[23:17] <staxjax> and the land *was* mostly comprised of sulphur b4 the wipe
[23:17] <staxjax> so I thought that might have had something to do with it
[23:17] <loftar> Farming was never related to map alchemy, though.
[23:17] <KarlHurtig> So land effect may have been a bug?
[23:17] <staxjax> ok, just coincidence that my crops taste like gun powder then
[23:18] <loftar> Fairly sure the land never had an effect at all.
[23:19] <loftar> Ah, actually, alchemy from applied fertilizers are actually mixed slightly into crops' alchemy, so that might explain a map alchemy effect.
[23:19] <KarlHurtig> Staxjax: didn't you say that people pre-nerf were getting 2.0+ purity multiplier prior to farming easily?
[23:19] <KarlHurtig> oh
[23:19] <staxjax> ahh
[23:19] <staxjax> cuz I was using p4 deer meat for humus
[23:19] <staxjax> well, 70%ish lead
[23:19] <staxjax> I mean sulphur
[23:20] <staxjax> then using the humus to fertilze
[23:20] <loftar> Yes, that would explain it.
[23:20] <staxjax> good to know
[23:21] <KarlHurtig> Any possibility to let us know how large effect it is? Something like (A*seed + B*[all fertilizers/# fertilizers] )/ (A+B) ?
[23:21] <KarlHurtig> then after that the random factor [-5,5] is added and then normalized?
[23:22] <loftar> Well, I could tell you, but I'm probably going to change it anyway, KarlHurtig.
[23:23] <KarlHurtig> Loftar, would appriciate understanding of the current system XD, so ya even if you change it later, would be nice to know how it is currently.
[23:26] <loftar> Well, under the current regime, crop alchemy is mixed with fertilizer alchemy at a 9:1 ration, KarlHurtig.
[23:26] <loftar> Or, well, actually (9 + number of already applied fertilizers):1.
[23:28] <staxjax> so right now, the only way to fertilize crops effectively to increase the purity is by using humus and hay
[23:28] <loftar> Well, can you get pure humus and hay these days?
[23:28] <Trojanz> humus from seeds
[23:28] <KarlHurtig> yeah
[23:28] <Trojanz> hay from fields only but that clearly wont be enough for other fields ;p
[23:28] <loftar> Provided you already have pure seeds since the olden days, or whay?
[23:28] <loftar> what*

after that subject of discussion changed.

[loftar]

[23:19] <loftar> Ah, actually, alchemy from applied fertilizers are actually mixed slightly into crops' alchemy, so that might explain a map alchemy effect.

At first, I actually thought that fertilizer influence had been removed, so I might have been under that misconception when I talked to Potjeh as well. I think it has been my intention to remove it, at least.

It is my general intention to try and think of newer kinds of alchemical mechanisms in general, and it may well happen that they will replace per-generation seed randomization as well. It remains to be seen. :)

[APXEOLOG]

It is my general intention to try and think of newer kinds of alchemical mechanisms in general, and it may well happen that they will replace per-generation seed randomization as well. It remains to be seen.

So you still haven't got finished mechanics for purity and we free to create such themes in ideas&innovations? If so some words about what main aspects do you want to see in such mechanics?