Was Salem a better game before MM took over?

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Re: Was Salem a better game before MM took over?

Postby TotalyMeow » Thu Jun 01, 2017 8:37 pm

When the Tribe was at it's strongest, defenses were such that you could lose any crime alt you had spent "months or years" building up, along with it's entire base, in a matter of a few hours. I guess you forgot about the time when that actually happened.
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Re: Was Salem a better game before MM took over?

Postby Heffernan » Thu Jun 01, 2017 9:12 pm

Realak wrote: So either you get used to the alt life or you are in for a rude awakening


ok... sorry Meow and JC i didnt want to do this but since its already out, this is what JC has been working on the past months...

a New Game

Image
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Re: Was Salem a better game before MM took over?

Postby Realak » Thu Jun 01, 2017 9:13 pm

It was a bit more then a few hours I remember all nighters to wipe a base literally. My point stands - at least you had to breach defenses compared to this 4 hour summon crap.

And to counter your point my ramblings about changing health values or make basic infrastructure buildings basically immortal unless you wanna bang on it 12+ hours straight is just a much better fix then going to sleep for 4 hours 30 mins and waking up to a dead main when he was inside his layered base.
Like I said most of the enjoyment in raiding was the chance of pvp and loot. People wasted bases because they could - I don't think anyone would care that you got left enough basic infrastructure to recover without a fresh start.

Raider is happy, got kills, got loots, got pvp, got glory.
Le Raided is not so happy, but at least he doesn't have to start completely fresh and if determined could quickly recover.
It boggles my mind how JC wants you not to be able to wipe months of someones hard infrastructure, but yet you can undo a years old character in four hours.
And since scents don't distinguish right from wrong you could have just killed a titan raider in your last act of desperation defending your base and guess what?

You are now dead - or get used to 3 hour 30 minute naps for the next 18 days.
That's pretty bad. You can't deny that. If i went to a random gaming forum and explained this mechanic and wanted peoples reaction to it - guess what? It would be a ***** joke.
Last edited by Realak on Thu Jun 01, 2017 9:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Was Salem a better game before MM took over?

Postby Realak » Thu Jun 01, 2017 9:13 pm

Heffernan wrote:
Realak wrote: So either you get used to the alt life or you are in for a rude awakening


ok... sorry Meow and JC i didnt want to do this but since its already out, this is what JC has been working on the past months...

a New Game

Image



That's awesome.
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Re: Was Salem a better game before MM took over?

Postby Judaism » Thu Jun 01, 2017 9:16 pm

TotalyMeow wrote:When the Tribe was at it's strongest, defenses were such that you could lose any crime alt you had spent "months or years" building up, along with it's entire base, in a matter of a few hours. I guess you forgot about the time when that actually happened.


You woudn't spend months or years on those characters, the highest stat character was Binks, which honestly given the current characters is far from impressive with the old legacy humus. Bear in mind, the strongest character from all the three servers would take 100's of runs to bash a steel wall, one that is not defended by defense structures. Neither were almost none of those bases comparative with any current strongholds. For arguments sake you should look at Heffernan's base for example. I have had talks with Binks back in the past and he also stated that some bases were almost unraidable at the time of Roanoke, the ones that had multiple layers of tree-walls, brazier walls and actual good defences and somewhat comparative to current proper bases. Maybe you would force your way through to quickly summon, however fully cleaning those bases would still take you days, we are talking about 500+ braziers and mazes of treewalls/walls. The crime runs used to be far more efficient, however also take much longer. The critical damage could actually still result into casualties and there have been cases where the entire force was outplayed by a single or two defenders (mushi's base)which resulted into dead characters on MM's side. You coudn't do it with active defenders when the base only had 8 orso layers of stone walls, not even plank, not even brick and not even steel. Repairing was awesome back then and would force confrontation between defenders and raiders.

The objects were indeed destroyable, MM tribe had a habit of destroying all suspects. That was fairly pointless, nowadays however townbells/authority objects are destructible which allows total take-over or weak links in base structures and result into an entire character lock-down ass well.
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Re: Was Salem a better game before MM took over?

Postby TotalyMeow » Fri Jun 02, 2017 1:58 am

Realak wrote:It was a bit more then a few hours I remember all nighters to wipe a base literally. My point stands - at least you had to breach defenses compared to this 4 hour summon crap.

And to counter your point my ramblings about changing health values or make basic infrastructure buildings basically immortal unless you wanna bang on it 12+ hours straight is just a much better fix then going to sleep for 4 hours 30 mins and waking up to a dead main when he was inside his layered base.


Only a character that has valid scents out can be summoned.

I'm not talking about wiping a base. Yeah, it also used to be possible to wipe an entire town completely to the ground in less than a day. In a few hours if you had enough people, and I'm pretty sure everyone is glad that's no longer the case. But what I was referring to was breaking into a vault. For those who haven't played long enough to remember, there didn't used to be trial by fire, there didn't used to be splash damage, but walls were much weaker and didn't go higher than plank, and braziers used to be much weaker and without crits and they never ran out of fuel. So, players would build bases with multiple layers of walls, braizers trapped inside them, and just a claim, and a bunch of crime character leantos in the center. These were called vaults. It used to be possible to break into such a vault in a few hours if you were competent. Maybe it was before Realak's time, but when the Tribe was at war with the Russians, the tribe had a massively fortified vault in the SW corner of the map on top of a mountain (mountains were never smooth then and so the climb to the top was hell). The Russians, in a brilliant raid, climbed the mountain and broke in in something like 3 hours, and killed all the tribe crime characters in there. No warning, logged in after work and all the primary raiders were gone, even though PMP had checked from work at lunch.

With all the changes to defense we made, and some that Jorb and Loftar made before selling the game to us, that tension of being able to lose a crime character at any time was lost. The trial by combat was an attempt to get some of that back. But now you don't get killed without warning, you at least have the Trial shadow to warn you, which takes some time to activate. You get a chance to fight for your life when it does activate rather than being leanto summoned which was instant and unavoidable death. And not all scents activate in only four hours, iirc murder takes 12. The shorter activating scents are also the shortest lived scents so it's not as difficult to keep alert as it used to be either.
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Re: Was Salem a better game before MM took over?

Postby Dallane » Fri Jun 02, 2017 2:04 am

I like how most of the people crying about current mechanics were too scared to do anything during the Tribes reign. Everyone bent the knee and stopped playing on a entire server due to pvp being so ***** broken. GT were the only people actually participating in pvp with the tribe back then. People like juda have no clue wtf they are talking about. Sure current mechanics are terrible but it's much better than where we were. After JC is able to tweek and balance things to a more even playing field then it will be a ton better.
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TotalyMeow wrote: Claeyt's perspective of Salem and what it's about is very different from the devs and in many cases is completely the opposite of what we believe.
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Re: Was Salem a better game before MM took over?

Postby Memento » Fri Jun 02, 2017 2:26 am

Dallane wrote: After JC is able to tweek and balance things to a more even playing field then it will be a ton better.


How long? Dude wont even comment on forums of his own game!

I want to be scared walking around in Salem, I want the thrill of not knowing if my base will be there when I wake up. I thought this what this game was about. ARK is scarier at the moment.
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Re: Was Salem a better game before MM took over?

Postby Dallane » Fri Jun 02, 2017 3:08 am

Memento wrote:How long? Dude wont even comment on forums of his own game!


Soon.
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TotalyMeow wrote: Claeyt's perspective of Salem and what it's about is very different from the devs and in many cases is completely the opposite of what we believe.
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Re: Was Salem a better game before MM took over?

Postby Memento » Fri Jun 02, 2017 3:18 am

On a lighter note, I just logged into my base after about a month. I saw a scent in my base and was trying to figure out how it happened as I saw to broken wall. It took me about 5 minutes to realize it was a moral mushroom not a scent. Reminds me of the time I scared my self with my own red square. I love that dangerous feeling.
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