Patch 2.2.5 Tulip Mania!

Announcements of major changes to Salem.

Re: Patch 2.2.5 Tulip Mania!

Postby Judaism » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:06 pm

grapefruitv wrote:Grapes were ridiculously OP and it was very clear that they are going to be adjusted down eventually, whether their original values were a bug or intended. Of all things that is not something I expected to see people complain about.


Grapes values were reported by us the very first week, it was then skill gated to fruit orchards. So in conclusion it should had been fixed the first time and not this long after, now people have their entire production and skills build around it. Same goes for those new mechanics such as barrel booms and catapults, its just an endless cycle you have to adapt on a server with such a supposedly short time span.
JohnCarver wrote:Mortal Moments Inc. is not here to cannibalize the community or piece out the code. We are not here because we wish to institute pay to win models or PvE servers. Quite the contrary.
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Re: Patch 2.2.5 Tulip Mania!

Postby Nikixos » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:09 pm

Judaism wrote:In any case it is not normal to have seen this many changes within the span of mere weeks,

Do i think changes so drastic to alt raising such as pinecone nerf and grape nerf would have taken place in the next expedition? Yes
Does JC have time to wait for the next expedition and hold all development until next 6 months? nah.

Judaism wrote:it does not make sense either on a server with an estimated time window of around 3-6 months.



Neither were cannons in the first 3 weeks of the server, yet you proved devs wrong by buying all steel from alloying packs from other players. I don't see the problem.
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Re: Patch 2.2.5 Tulip Mania!

Postby Judaism » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:12 pm

Nikixos wrote:Neither were cannons in the first 3 weeks of the server, yet you proved devs wrong by buying all steel from alloying packs from other players. I don't see the problem.


You are wrong, 8/10 steel bars were made by ourselves. (we had forgotten the requirements for a cannon so we were 2 bars short) Stop trying to make it personal, we exceeded in every possible way from our competition. (it was biles, skills, base, map scouting, etc)

Do I think its wrong that you can basically buy a town on day 1 with p2w, ofcourse and blister-steel should not come in packages either. Relevant changes should not be made in an on-going competition, with such a limited time window. Generally we are the ones profiting from most changes, is it the salvage change, the grape change, the barrel-boom change, the catapult change.

It is however very much against my principles I'd like to see things progress, the rule-set was clear and should had stayed that way for the current expedition.
Last edited by Judaism on Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
JohnCarver wrote:Mortal Moments Inc. is not here to cannibalize the community or piece out the code. We are not here because we wish to institute pay to win models or PvE servers. Quite the contrary.
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Re: Patch 2.2.5 Tulip Mania!

Postby Rifmaster » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:18 pm

Nikixos wrote:Does JC have time to wait for the next expedition and hold all development until next 6 months? nah.



Yea, holding all development and changing what players have progressed into and focused on for a month and a half is the same, sure.

If such a huge change was going to happen, it should have happened at the beginning of the server, not when the industry for it has already been made.
Nobody would have complained if a new way to improve characters or whatever was introduced, but changing already existing things to put developed and undeveloped players on the same or closer level is absolutely unfair.
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Re: Patch 2.2.5 Tulip Mania!

Postby Judaism » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:21 pm

Rifmaster wrote:If such a huge change was going to happen, it should have happened at the beginning of the server, not when the industry for it has already been made.


And that is exactly my point, he was very much aware of grapes since we intended to utilize them the very first week but then he skill gated it to fruit orchards which was quite a skill to get at that point. There is absolutely no excuse for the current miscalculation and we are in such a state where it is absolutely a large change for production, skills and the bile gap.

In the end, it is not about grapes its about all those changes combined and you simply do not do that with an on-going competition not as common practice.
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Re: Patch 2.2.5 Tulip Mania!

Postby grapefruitv » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:26 pm

Couple hundreds berry bushes can hardly be called an industry though. One can set it going in one fay + few days waiting time. Everything else used in creating fruit foods, like honey or grapes themselves, did not become useless with this patch.
I agree that general rules should not be changed too much that late into the server, but this change is truly minor and long expected.
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Re: Patch 2.2.5 Tulip Mania!

Postby Nikixos » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:32 pm

Rifmaster wrote:
Nikixos wrote:
Noone gives a ***** about concord anymore
I lost all hope of winning concorde, so nobody gives a ***** about it right?



Lmao bro, i posted 2 statue locations and kkk base the first week of the server, do you think i wanted to ever win ?
I play for fun and if i find it fun trolling vets and posting "secret" info or trolling juda into thinking we are seriously raiding their base (which happened to be 10+ ppl with 40 humours alts raised last night) so be it ¦] ¦]
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Re: Patch 2.2.5 Tulip Mania!

Postby Rifmaster » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:36 pm

Nikixos wrote:I play for fun


The universal cry of a hopeless player.
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Re: Patch 2.2.5 Tulip Mania!

Postby Judaism » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:44 pm

grapefruitv wrote:Couple hundreds berry bushes can hardly be called an industry though. One can set it going in one fay + few days waiting time. Everything else used in creating fruit foods, like honey or grapes themselves, did not become useless with this patch.


Stop looking at it from a Providence perspective, you are going to need a town to get the space for the 100's of tiles of shift fence for the grape production and the berry bushes then you are going to want to wall it in, you also simply do not have that many pots the first few weeks and so on. On Providence your logic stands but on Concord you are building all these things up small and takes weeks. We have 1000's of tiles of makeshift fences (they spread slow) and a few hundred bushes and that took weeks to build up, in addition to having like 4 characters with the fruit orchard skill.

Lets say it was not changed, now a catapult could ruin all of it from out of render. The initial base plans are entirely shattered due to new mechanics such as barrel booms and catapults, then we have the witch b/s if you had already leveled up your PP and some more things which are very troublesome and which you could not anticipate. It all should had happened before the release of the expedition or in the new expedition and now it is being treated as a playground where they simply tweek, adapt and change implemented changes.
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Re: Patch 2.2.5 Tulip Mania!

Postby yuukki » Wed Feb 14, 2018 12:05 am

Not sure why its even debated at this point but put simply cash shop should just be deactivated for the expedition, it would solve all the issues. No cheating your way through getting iron, tons of inspiration free, various goods (oiled, planed, steels, etc.) and no purchasing of silver.

While we (kkk group) did almost all of our silver legit and fairly easily, it's also just as possible and was triple checked that you could literally swipe a card for around $900~ to get almost a full town bell day one iirc. Of course thats a ton of money and offers very little in all honesty. I am interested in the next expedition and the affect the stone wall change will have (requiring dry boards) but at the end of the day most expedition issues stemmed from the cash shop being abused.
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