Bees and Honey

Forum for suggesting changes to Salem.

Bees and Honey

Postby Dallane » Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:42 pm

With the different types of fruit trees in game I think that honey should be expanded and more difficult to obtain.

Depending on the type of fruit grown near the skep should produce a different type of honey. Honey can go from water white to a dark amber color. Each with a different benefit to the player once consumed. Having many different types of fruit near a hive will make a different kind of honey with it's own hybrid of the types of trees but less powerful buff compared to a pure honey which would give a single greater buff. Ex(not actual buff idea just making something random up to show wtf i'm saying): apple honey will give 10 blood. cherry honey will give 10 yellow. Honey made from a combo of both trees will give 5 blood and yellow. Something to that effect.

Checking on skeps should be more dangerous. You should always take damage or receive a debuff for disturbing bees such as a poison or infection. A new item bee smoker should be created that you will have to calm the bees to not receive damage. These have been used in different forms throughout history. I'm not sure but I think modern bees suits haven't been used until recently but if wanted you would add in some cool looking cloths to help beekeepers.

Checking on bees often should give them more of a penalty in their production. Checking on them more will result in a more healthy colony but checking on them less will result in better purity and quantity. Checking more often should result in quicker colony collapse.

Cold snap should be a much more dangerous time for bees. If there are not enough drones to keep the queen warm then she will die. If there isn't enough honey produced so far to feed the colony then they will all starve. So if you made a hive, threw in your bees and the next day winter hits then you bees aren't going to have a great time. Harvesting after a cold snap will result in less honey.

There should also be more natural predators to the bee such as a beetle. This could lead to interesting sabotage and paranoia as someone will not know if a town member planted the beetle or mother nature came to feast. This will also lead to the beekeeper having to check his hives more or pray that there isn't a beetle in there in fear of angering the colony.

The new alcohol system would benefit from this. Players will be able to make different kinds of mead.

Cooking can also be expanded with new recipes. Baking could be expanded greatly. Each type of honey can give a different humor gain.

New medicine could be added with a hive having a chance to drop Propolis once harvested.

A new higher skill for beekeepers to create a skep with a glass jar on top that you can harvest honey without destroying the hive but still have that option if desired for more materials. Another top tier skill can be used to create a more modern type hive that was created close to later part of salem's time period. This could lead to more industry type machines to extract honey and place the hive frames back into the hive.

Honey must be stored in glass jars.
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Re: Bees and Honey

Postby Messyng » Fri Aug 11, 2017 9:33 pm

Interesting ideas, especially for the alcohol system, I would like one day to make honey vinegar and use it for cheese-making.

As for medicine, I think it is to early to talk, maybe if new bosses where added that are promised in roadmap and fighting them to often you could suffer some kind of penalty, maybe the medicine from Propolis would help greatly.

Also this suggestions make it like a whole new industry, and by complicating bee-keeping there should be worthy benefits for bothering with it at all, since now instead of spending some minutes to check every day, in the future you will have to spend more and consequently less time to do other things in Salem.
Due to the circumstances, due to my stubbornness.
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Re: Bees and Honey

Postby Darwoth » Fri Aug 11, 2017 10:56 pm

one problem is nobody uses honey anymore for fruit since kandarims bot happily lets them piss out a waterfall of berry juice in a day that is enough to last for ten summers, variety is good as is depth but adding another ten steps and processes to honey personally speaking would just cause me to say ***** it altogether and stop keeping bees as is it enough of a pain in the ass already once you go over a certain number of skeps, wait weeks for the skeps to fill, then go dig clay for an entire day to rebuild them while checking once a day for a new queen (if your doing it properly, i already tend to just let my hives sit due to said pain in ass factor.

if i dropped about 1500 bucks on lumber, a dozen starter colonies and beekeepers protective equipment i would have between 2000 - 3000 pounds of honey and around 300 - 500 pounds of beeswax after about a year of minimal maintenance, less than i spend currently on bees in salem.

this is why salem sucks and nobody plays, because like every other game 90% of salem is a levelling treadmill to stay competitive, the remaining 10% of the "fun" in a given game is what you get to experience after suffering through that particular games treadmill and engage in end game pvp (which was broken well over two years ago for all the exact reasons i pointed out when the stupidity laden "jinglebombs" patch was released and the numerous mini patches around that timeframe) or dragon raids (which dont exist here, unless you count me i suppose) or whatever that game has. the primary difference here is that the "leveling" has taken the place of hours and hours of pointless chores that you must complete or the "levelling" you have done up to that point takes a **** and you start over. additions like the kandarim client has made the problem exponentially worse and cause people to lose touch with how the game "really is" and how much of an ungodly timesink many of the things in it are.

i am easily the top player in the game by far, regardless of whatever lie or embellishment i tell about the number and strength of my characters i easily have the strongest character on the server in terms of biles and skills (and have not done much to him since returning from popham with him nearly a year ago now) and i easily have more combat ready fighters in the mid to high hundreds than any other faction on the server combined. but i have barely played salem in a year and a half since i locked down popham, literally almost ALL of my game time since then has been doing stupid ***** ***** i cant stand doing. i get to do the exact same real life chores that i could choose to do in real life except in a pixelated world with no reward and then on top of that the amount of time it takes to do most of these things in game takes about 3 - 5x longer than the same thing in real life.

when i can prepare an AMAZING dinner in a few hours of occasionally going back and forth to the kitchen but it takes me either weeks of waiting on summer and 8 hours of picking fruit at the end or far more than that by prepping/cooking 8 billion dogturd pies things are just ***** stupid.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

example of my typical gameplay these days:

help newbs starting out not lose everything and quit by answering forum pms

get ***** at by literally anywhere from 2 - 5 nerd chicks that want my **** because i do not have time or ***** to give about small talk or idle rumors/gossip so spend an hour or so going round and round with whoever is butthurt at me on that particular day.

breaking down and rebuilding skeps once every 12 days or so (something most others dont bother with at all thanks to kandarims distiller bot)

growing approx 400 fields of food to feed animals once every 2 - 3 days

feeding animals daily or twice daily

curing animals daily or twice daily

moving/butchering animals every two days

growing treats to lower anger every 3ish days

managing anger levels of them daily

feeding turkeys daily or twice daily

checking for TBFs and paying upkeep on 2 dozen towns daily that i only keep since i raided them because there was supposed to be a salvage feature added 2.5 years ago

keep in mind we are not discussing 2 cows and a pig like most of the retards in this game would have, you need hundreds of each if you want any usefulness out of them. this includes turkeys, you know the things that "taipion of the masons" ( :lol: :lol: :lol: ) and creator of the cowardbot that plays an alarm for him so that he can blindly ***** through the game in condition white and have an automaton let him know when he needs to **** his pants and run away because a player loaded within a 100 tiles of him.

absolutely none of the above is "fun" once the novelty of it wears thin which is quick and you can ask any of the few people i have on my kin list about what sort of "mood" i tend to be in for the duration of each evening when i log on to do all this stupid ***** that i should not have to do, couple this with a scandalous and trashy as ***** playerbase with no integrity made up of 90% euro's who have been the classic "ill just use a cheat program" sector of the online gaming community since literally the dawn of the internet and the first games in existence. this is why many games have "regional" servers even though the server is located in the same building and the latency times are the same, it is a marketing move because many americans simply wont play on a european server due to the rampant third party program abuse that occurs, and will not play on chinese servers unless they want to fight the entire server (the chinese and korean players are as bad if not worse than russians when it comes to dogpiling on anyone not of a common language/region)

anyway guess what im saying is none of those are particularly bad ideas with regard to honey, but until sweeping strides are made to make the game less of a "job" it would prob not compliment the already overwhelming and lifesucking flow of gameplay in general :lol:


the server will burn from one end to the other the day that i decide i no longer care about checking satellite "towns", keeping turkeys, quickly replacing a lost raider or playing whatever new expedition comes out for a statue i still have not gotten from the last one 8 months later when that was the whole god damn point i went there. store credit i still have not gotten 8 months later (i raid most of the **** i need and get stock certs for killing murderers fairly frequently so am not a big store buyer like the retards that buy 200 couches and sit in town for 14 hours a day trying to sell them to people but regardless have spent about a grand on salem total over the years, but never another dime until there are mass improvements across the board), the 1600 stat t3 witch that has still not been copied over 8 months later, the chest of bringbacks that have still not been brought over 8 months later, reward items that still do not work 8 months later and so on or maintaining a useful size herd of animals and instead just go back to what i consider fun, kicking the asses of giant gnat clouds of loud talking forum retards that pretend to think they are better than they are.

if JC is not back by mid winter with a lengthy list of things that suck less i am going to circle the wagons and move everything of value to my impregnable northern fortress, drop an assbeating on every last retard on the server i have a grudge against, let the animals starve to death and just ***** on the forums since currently that is by far the most time rewarding and fun aspect of gameplay.

no idea how honey got me into rant mode but trust me i have a lot more, luckily i have to go log in and spend the next 2 - 3 hours doing maintenance for absolutely no ***** reason whatsoever.
Last edited by Darwoth on Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bees and Honey

Postby Dallane » Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:04 pm

Wow if a idea for honey enrages darwoth this much it has to be added in!
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Re: Bees and Honey

Postby Darwoth » Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:11 pm

:lol: :lol: :lol:

idea was not bad on its own merit, just made me think of the 200 or so skeps i have to redo and how with this there would then be more "crap" associated with doing that, then i allowed myself to wander into a bunch of the other "chores" that take longer than their real world equivalents and assorted related annoyances.
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Re: Bees and Honey

Postby ZoddAlmighty » Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:40 pm

Honey would be alot more viable option if skeps were reusable.
Them breaking down after X number of honey harvest (With the ability to be repaired when they are under 50%).
Also, honey needs to go down from 0.05 per fruit to 0.01 per fruit to be competitive with berry juice.
Though, if JC was actually paying any ***** attention to his game he would see that there are so ***** many timesinks that serve absolutelly no purpose except to make life hard for people who are playing the game.
Boters wont ***** care about them.
Why cant we have a different interface for destilers? The one where a person would see all 5 empty slots and just scroll stuff in them? Why dont we get a system to automatically empty vials?
Why dont we get a tool or what ever thats going to speed up picking the trees and berries?
Why dont we get a ***** coal shovel to fill up the furnaces?
Why for the love of god i cant use a bucket or a barrel or anything to fill up a pot thats over a fireplace? Instead i have to empty it, remove it, tank it and put it back?! Makes no ***** sense.
Why dont we get digging sets fixed? Terraforming is so ***** slow and unrewarding it makes me want to puke. My townies and myself terraformed the hell out of Westpine and it aint even done.
Can we get a normal randomizer? Not a **** one that averages everything out on 33%. Cool, got 300 stocks and cultivars, to ***** bad ill get 100 average rolls on my fields. (works on anything, it always averages out on 33%).
What about the events? Put aside the fact that they have bad randomization, multiple events spawn on the same tile, they also serve no ***** purpose. At best gimmicks in my opinion.
yeah,we got train oil (wooohooo) buuuut we can only use it thermometers ? xD
What of value has been added to the game in last 1.5 years. Coldsnap update was pretty ***** horrible. No problem for established players, a pain in the ass for the new ones. Especially ones who dont have people to guide them to the right forums and wiki.
I understand the game is designed to be grindy, but most of the things that people do is maintenance. No ***** where maintenance requires this much effort unless you live on ISS (international space station) and you live in the ***** space.
I wish i had animals, but if they are this much ***** pain id rather not bother. Then, you developers wonder why nobody bothered to do an Arc on Popham. They were probably like ***** these animals, they are so much pain.
Only saving grace for myself is the fact that i have commited townies. Cant even imagine how it is for solo players that are competitive.
P.S.
Great Idea Dallane, lets see if anything will be added to the game.
Dallane wrote:Sorry for the trolling and derailing. I updated the OP with the fix action you found. GJ sir!
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Re: Bees and Honey

Postby Darwoth » Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:03 am

ZoddAlmighty wrote:Honey would be alot more viable option if skeps were reusable.
Them breaking down after X number of honey harvest (With the ability to be repaired when they are under 50%).
Also, honey needs to go down from 0.05 per fruit to 0.01 per fruit to be competitive with berry juice.
Though, if JC was actually paying any ***** attention to his game he would see that there are so ***** many timesinks that serve absolutelly no purpose except to make life hard for people who are playing the game.
Boters wont ***** care about them.
Why cant we have a different interface for destilers? The one where a person would see all 5 empty slots and just scroll stuff in them? Why dont we get a system to automatically empty vials?
Why dont we get a tool or what ever thats going to speed up picking the trees and berries?
Why dont we get a ***** coal shovel to fill up the furnaces?
Why for the love of god i cant use a bucket or a barrel or anything to fill up a pot thats over a fireplace? Instead i have to empty it, remove it, tank it and put it back?! Makes no ***** sense.
Why dont we get digging sets fixed? Terraforming is so ***** slow and unrewarding it makes me want to puke. My townies and myself terraformed the hell out of Westpine and it aint even done.
Can we get a normal randomizer? Not a **** one that averages everything out on 33%. Cool, got 300 stocks and cultivars, to ***** bad ill get 100 average rolls on my fields. (works on anything, it always averages out on 33%).
What about the events? Put aside the fact that they have bad randomization, multiple events spawn on the same tile, they also serve no ***** purpose. At best gimmicks in my opinion.
yeah,we got train oil (wooohooo) buuuut we can only use it thermometers ? xD
What of value has been added to the game in last 1.5 years. Coldsnap update was pretty ***** horrible. No problem for established players, a pain in the ass for the new ones. Especially ones who dont have people to guide them to the right forums and wiki.
I understand the game is designed to be grindy, but most of the things that people do is maintenance. No ***** where maintenance requires this much effort unless you live on ISS (international space station) and you live in the ***** space.
I wish i had animals, but if they are this much ***** pain id rather not bother. Then, you developers wonder why nobody bothered to do an Arc on Popham. They were probably like ***** these animals, they are so much pain.
Only saving grace for myself is the fact that i have commited townies. Cant even imagine how it is for solo players that are competitive.
P.S.
Great Idea Dallane, lets see if anything will be added to the game.



zodd would be a good addition to the mason forum
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Re: Bees and Honey

Postby Reviresco » Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:12 am

At least restoring the Domesticated Meat group is as easy as restoring Mushrooms or Shellfish.

Maybe even easier!
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Re: Bees and Honey

Postby belgear » Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:26 am

I am not getting what is so hard about turning the distillers that requires a bot.

Honey is no fun.

With all of these things, though, is it supposed to be something that someone should be able to easily farm by themselves? Should every meal option be available to hermits? What the ***** is the point of living in a town?
Last edited by belgear on Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bees and Honey

Postby ZoddAlmighty » Sat Aug 12, 2017 12:31 am

Reviresco wrote:At least restoring the Domesticated Meat group is as easy as restoring Mushrooms or Shellfish.

Maybe even easier!

Yeah , when ever im in darkness i have to chase away newbs with a broom because i cant hunt how many of them there are xD
"Shoo , ***** off little newb. Let me kill some argos" - actuall quotte im not being sarcastic.
There is a ***** of things thats can have improvement /rework or balancing.
Im all for new content but you dont put ***** spoilers on a car when you are missing tires. Or maybe you do, what do i know
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