Fundamentals?

[Ailaa]

I like both your ides Carver. The game is abit complicated when it comes to both inspiration and gluttony. It takes some time to understand, and people who have played the game for awhile probaly fully understand it, and don't mind it. But this game should not try to only satisfy the older playerbase, but the game needs to attract new players too fill up the players who leave.

Most people who play MMORPG are used to "leveling" and most likely would fully understand that doing certain things, raises your profiency, so i think that would be a welcome addition for many new players. I am just abit afraid it would make the inspirational system obsolete, and somewhat suspicous too what will replace it.

The idé for the gluttony system also sounds nice, but all depends on the "cravings" you get. I think you need to explain abit more in detail, as it sounds like some food items would become obsolete. If you desire a certain food group, then what would be the point in making the hardest item in that food group?

[eldoran]

that could change two of my most concerning issues i do have with the game to the better, even after spending hours and hours of time to get a clue for the gluttonysystem i still havent found a good way to take advantage of the mechanic, and also i try not to make assumptions based on only my personal experience i strongly believe that there are many others who do have the same problem. and i like systems in wich you make progress by doing the tasks that is not to say that the insp system isn't also compelling maybe there is a way to combine those two.

[Otis]

First, its nice that you are asking. If I have to pick it will be #2 but not because I think it is broken.

How about a option #4 - fix things that are broken and finish/flesh out things that are unfinished?

So because of fruit trees, animals, and other holes/depth in the food bucket I will go for Gluttony in the hopes that as part of it the unfinished things get finished.

[Asgaroth22]

I like both your ides Carver. The game is abit complicated when it comes to both inspiration and gluttony. It takes some time to understand, and people who have played the game for awhile probaly fully understand it, and don't mind it. But this game should not try to only satisfy the older playerbase, but the game needs to attract new players too fill up the players who leave.

Most people who play MMORPG are used to "leveling" and most likely would fully understand that doing certain things, raises your profiency, so i think that would be a welcome addition for many new players. I am just abit afraid it would make the inspirational system obsolete, and somewhat suspicous too what will replace it.

The idé for the gluttony system also sounds nice, but all depends on the "cravings" you get. I think you need to explain abit more in detail, as it sounds like some food items would become obsolete. If you desire a certain food group, then what would be the point in making the hardest item in that food group?

Everyone here was a new player once, and we all had to learn the mechanics. We somehow managed, so why shouldn't new players? I like that the game doesn't hand us everything on a tray, that we need to find out things for ourselves.
I'd too love some further explanation of the gluttony changes.

[Ailaa]

I like both your ides Carver. The game is abit complicated when it comes to both inspiration and gluttony. It takes some time to understand, and people who have played the game for awhile probaly fully understand it, and don't mind it. But this game should not try to only satisfy the older playerbase, but the game needs to attract new players too fill up the players who leave.

Most people who play MMORPG are used to "leveling" and most likely would fully understand that doing certain things, raises your profiency, so i think that would be a welcome addition for many new players. I am just abit afraid it would make the inspirational system obsolete, and somewhat suspicous too what will replace it.

The idé for the gluttony system also sounds nice, but all depends on the "cravings" you get. I think you need to explain abit more in detail, as it sounds like some food items would become obsolete. If you desire a certain food group, then what would be the point in making the hardest item in that food group?

Everyone here was a new player once, and we all had to learn the mechanics. We somehow managed, so why shouldn't new players? I like that the game doesn't hand us everything on a tray, that we need to find out things for ourselves.
I'd too love some further explanation of the gluttony changes.

I've quit this game 4-5 times? Alot in the beginning due to not understanding the system. The reason i came back, is because i played Haven and Hearth alot. The DEVS want to attract new players. Some of these players REALLY enjoy this kinda games, and take the effort to learn the system by going on forums, wiki, spending time etc. But some people will lose intrest if they do not understand the system in a reasonable amount of time. I am not saying "dumb" it down, but just make the system somewhat understandable in the beginning.

This game need the system to be easy to understand, somewhat "logical". A leveling system is logical and it is something most players are used to. I am not saying it is wrong to have a completely different system, but if you going to, make sure it will be very easy to understand in the early parts of the game. For people who are used to a leveling system will most likely just assume that even this game has something similair.

In all honesty i enjoy this system. But it is because i understand it! And that i took the time and effort to come back and learn it. Most players will not do this, and i'd rather have a Salem filled with players and an easier system, then a hard system with a small dedicated fan base.

[Potjeh]

Has anyone ever complained that the game needs better mechanics for "personal progression while still contributing to the common good of a town"?

Yes.

But what is more concerning is that even veterans like yourself like to pretend that 'spies' are a real problem if you know what you are doing when they clearly are not. The problem lies with members of towns more often than not do not pull their weight and/or contribute enough when given the opportunity to bask in communism. A direct reward based on the highest contributors is needed, the question is how to get there, and if it is priority.

How you arrived from this to "we need to buff mindless repetition of the same actions" is beyond me. Isn't the obvious solution here tracking various statistics for town members so the town authorities can easily tell who's not pulling their weight? At the very least you could expand the "crafted by" info that exists on clothes to all items and perhaps even buildings, though it'd take ages to assess the situation if this was the only tool at mayor's disposal.

And yeah, Dallane is spot on, internal security is still a bad joke no matter how much you deny it, and infiltrators are a far more serious problem than moochers.

[Darwoth]

i enjoy the game as it is, the direction for both of these suggested changes sound like they will have more an effect on forcing people to "actively" play vs "passively" play. which while this might make the game more "fun" or "meaningful" for a newb in the beginning will do nothing but discourage and make things more tedious for the other 80% of us while at the same time dumbing down the overall system and shortening the learning curve between 2 week retards and people that have been around for over a year.

gutting core systems every few months and forcing folks to invest all of mentioned work all over again in new directions has been a constant theme for the past year and a half and is starting to suck quite a bit.

were the skill system to be changed in this direction vs inspirationals i would never again make another character or roll on a fresh server, game is time consuming as is and i simply do not have time to do chores to gain skills. the games system of gaining inspiration while offlline and channeling it into skills over a few minutes is ideal for both ***** and those with a life.

the gluttony issue is pretty much the same, the last thing i have time for is to fart around until my character decides he is hungry and then go rifle through 200 different foods to try and get a few stats, and unless i am going to keep a stockpile of hundreds of sheds to store all of those foods to have on hand this also basically eliminates benefit of advanced infrastructure in veteran towns vs *****. why bother having 80 smokers, an 800+ feasting set, 120 distillers, hundredss of fields, thousands of pots and so on when your gluttony session is derailed by not having the **** covered sandwich that popped up just like a random newb that started five minutes ago.

seems like the real aim with both of these suggestions is to eliminate alt creation without "technically" doing so, as nobody is going to actively play more than 1 - 2 characters with systems like these in place as they would have to constantly juggle between just the two to maintain any advancement of note.

when taking into account that my playstyle is doing a lot with a little (i make a dozen cheap characters instead of 1 huge character the way most do) and it is easy to see these proposed changes as stated would eliminate the way i play the game in addition to making the overall "workload" i am expected to invest to remain competitive even more than it already is thus i am not a fan.

[Ailaa]

gutting core systems every few months and forcing folks to invest all of mentioned work all over again in new directions has been a constant theme for the past year and a half and is starting to suck quite a bit.

+1, We really need you guys to make a system that works. But that possibly can be "tweaked", remaking it fully is not really a good idé. Rather you guys take abit longer, before implenting something, making sure it works.

[Darwoth]

but Ultima Online have good system grow character

no it didn't, it had a mind numbingly disgusting/tedious advancement system (hey guys magic resistance party, lets all get together and earthquake each other for 3 weeks to GM!!) that is why everyone in the game downloaded uoassist or razor and ran macros 24/7 for 2 weeks when making new characters, even when OSI was banning dozens of people a week in the first 2 years for doing so.

[HolyLight]

I would love passive progression ontop of the inspritional system, but balancing it would be tricky, but you should be able to do either one or both.

Maybe still gaining points and using them when studying OR when proforming tasks, so players who wish to use only inspritionals may do so, people who wish to get gains solely from doing activitys can do it via this new method, or you can do a bit of both, like a person who wants to train tailoring but is a miner can gain M&M by doing digging but can level his tailoring using inspritionals with no need to take part in activitys.

The glutton sounds intresting and would make a very nice change, it may also finally FORCE people to cook every type of food and use every type of food and force people away from the easy to mass produce, most effective foods.

Sounds fun and i look forward to playing the game again under these new systems, Now will such drastic changes cause a server wipe or maybe start a whole new perma 2nd providence server ?